# KES keys expired - trouble rotating **URL:** \ **Category:** Operate a Stake Pool\ **Created:** [14 September 2021 19:32 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170 "2021-09-14T19:32:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![PixelBlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@PixelBlock](https://forum.cardano.org/u/PixelBlock)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 05:37 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/42 "2021-09-17T05:37:43Z")
cpu is running around ~0.5% glive is still at the “Starting…” status for the last 45mins also cntools still says the KES keys have expired even after rotating, this could maybe the main issue as our pool is only just a month old ---
**Author:** ![Alexd1985](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alexd1985/32/23759_2.png) [@Alexd1985](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Alexd1985)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:09 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/43 "2021-09-17T06:09:40Z")
Forget about KES warning, the node doesn’t started type sudo systemctl status cnode ---
**Author:** ![PixelBlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@PixelBlock](https://forum.cardano.org/u/PixelBlock)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:15 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/44 "2021-09-17T06:15:48Z")
ok says the node is active and running ---
**Author:** ![Alexd1985](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alexd1985/32/23759_2.png) [@Alexd1985](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Alexd1985)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:23 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/45 "2021-09-17T06:23:35Z")
Show me the output, what is the output for sudo systemctl status cnode? also type nano ${HOME}/.bashrc and show me the last lines… the lines with export… ---
**Author:** ![PixelBlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@PixelBlock](https://forum.cardano.org/u/PixelBlock)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:30 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/46 "2021-09-17T06:30:06Z")
![putty_o6aQSlPP9A](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/uploads/cardano/original/3X/1/e/1ef0137fcab2fbbee5cf5431c6aae81fa89607c9.png) ![putty_1IQlXVkqRB](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/uploads/cardano/original/3X/e/b/ebd29706411eba90a3cf7985a0eb813613f34a01.png) ---
**Author:** ![Alexd1985](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alexd1985/32/23759_2.png) [@Alexd1985](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Alexd1985)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:39 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/47 "2021-09-17T06:39:50Z")
Ok, now… go to the topology file, delete the relay from there and add the IOHK nodes ```auto { "Producers": [ { "addr": "relays-new.cardano-mainnet.iohk.io", "port": 3001, "valency": 2 } ] } ``` Save the file and restart the node, how is the CPU now? ---
**Author:** ![PixelBlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@PixelBlock](https://forum.cardano.org/u/PixelBlock)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:51 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/48 "2021-09-17T06:51:07Z")
![putty_v4X7pUYBRF](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/uploads/cardano/original/3X/2/5/2555b4ae84c164a5cca4ff038c80b6e0cf928b30.png) so far the highest I’ve seen is 1% ---
**Author:** ![Alexd1985](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alexd1985/32/23759_2.png) [@Alexd1985](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Alexd1985)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:57 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/49 "2021-09-17T06:57:04Z")
Do u have teams? ---
**Author:** ![PixelBlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@PixelBlock](https://forum.cardano.org/u/PixelBlock)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:57 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/50 "2021-09-17T06:57:45Z")
no I don’t ---
**Author:** ![Alexd1985](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alexd1985/32/23759_2.png) [@Alexd1985](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Alexd1985)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 06:59 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/51 "2021-09-17T06:59:22Z")
Can u show me the env file? ---
**Author:** ![PixelBlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@PixelBlock](https://forum.cardano.org/u/PixelBlock)\ **Post date:** [17 September 2021 07:09 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/52 "2021-09-17T07:09:20Z")
actually just got teams up if you prefer using that, here’s a screenshot of the env file… ![WQIRIxtjJm](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/uploads/cardano/original/3X/1/5/159c31e8ad94e0985d192101cde8e95e9e137280.png) ---
**Author:** ![ADAMOONPOOL](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/adamoonpool/32/51691_2.png) [@ADAMOONPOOL](https://forum.cardano.org/u/ADAMOONPOOL)\ **Post date:** [18 September 2021 07:57 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/53 "2021-09-18T07:57:45Z")
Do you happen to have any backup of old files (priv/pool/) in the same folder or within any renamed folder? when we were rotating our keys from old to new, we kept a backup of folder with a different name than original folder and it was interfering with the key rotation. ---
**Author:** ![Pioneer187](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/pioneer187/32/49451_2.png) [@Pioneer187](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Pioneer187)\ **Post date:** [28 September 2021 13:11 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/54 "2021-09-28T13:11:41Z")
I ended up deleting the db folder and starting again. now syncing. Waiting to see if the KES keys have rotated ok. ---
**Author:** ![alias](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alias/32/39035_2.png) [@alias](https://forum.cardano.org/u/alias)\ **Post date:** [28 September 2021 23:06 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/55 "2021-09-28T23:06:32Z")
I read through this and having some simular problems since upgrading to 1.29.0. First, I had to upgrade each stake from 8GB to 16GB, however, when it came back up it said my KES Expiration data was today. I have attempted twice to generate the node.cert and ensure it has the permissions to get to access the poolkeys folder and run updated script from coincashew. The dates seem correct and no errors on creating the kes.skey and the node.cert from my air gap. I did however try to update my cardano-cli and cardano-node (binaries) on my air gap but ran into problems so I renamed the updated files and put the previous ones back. Would the older binaries prevent the kes update if they don’t match on block producer and air gap? At this point I think I need help because I am running around in circles. I can’t get the KES expiration date to change from yesterday. Journal errors for cardano-node Sep 28 23:25:23 wagyu cardano-node[776]: [wagyu:cardano.node.LeadershipCheck:Inf o:119] [2021-09-28 23:25:23.00 UTC] {“kind”:“TraceStartLeadershipCheck”,“chainDe nsity”:4.9500182e-2,“slot”:41305232,“delegMapSize”:839772,“utxoSize”:3316604,“cr edentials”:“Cardano”} ---
**Author:** ![Alexd1985](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/alexd1985/32/23759_2.png) [@Alexd1985](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Alexd1985)\ **Post date:** [29 September 2021 00:43 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/56 "2021-09-29T00:43:45Z")
> [@alias](#): > > Sep 28 23:25:23 wagyu cardano-node[776]: [wagyu:cardano.node.LeadershipCheck:Inf o:119] [2021-09-28 23:25:23.00 UTC] {“kind”:“TraceStartLeadershipCheck”,“chainDe nsity”:4.9500182e-2,“slot”:41305232,“delegMapSize”:839772,“utxoSize”:3316604,“cr edentials”:“Cardano”} but why you are saying you have issues with the new certificate? in glive it shows you the correct/new EXPIRATION date? try this command on live Producer curl localhost:12798/metrics | grep KES what is the output? ---
**Author:** ![Pioneer187](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/user_avatar/forum.cardano.org/pioneer187/32/49451_2.png) [@Pioneer187](https://forum.cardano.org/u/Pioneer187)\ **Post date:** [29 September 2021 10:50 UTC](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170/57 "2021-09-29T10:50:24Z")
![Screenshot 2021-09-29 at 11.47.14](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex023/uploads/cardano/original/3X/9/2/923ab99207098de14ba216be63560da631133820.png) Just to conclude the initial issue. All is good. Key rotation had worked fine (just needed to connect). [Previous page](https://forum.cardano.org/t/kes-keys-expired-trouble-rotating/74170.md?page=2)