Stake Pool Operators SPO

Staking & Delegation Setup a Stake Pool
21

If a pool adds value by helping the community, by developing apps, by education, by giving to charity and so on, it would not be strange if a delegator accepts 1,5% less returns annualy. And if the added value is high enough to attract enough of these type of delegators, the pool will eventually have enough stake to reach normal reward levels.

Basically I agree. But would also want to note that not all delegator will be acting purely based on maximum gains. Maybe some delegators might even want to create 2 wallets. one for the maximum gains and one to support the ecosystem.

22

That’s why I think Cardano will be more and more centralized.

Delegators have no reason to delegate to small pool.

Most of pools are will be reach to 64M saturation.

And then they will be splitted #1 and #2 or perhaps more big number like #24.

23

When you say the minimum fees will be lowered, what is going to look like?
Do you mean fixed cost 345 and margin 3% will be lowered?

24

Fixed fees are currently 340. This is the minimum. This minimum value will be lowered more to reflect current ada prices. Margin fees have no minimum value and can currently be 0%

25

Cardano currently has the most decentralized minting network around. And that is while we are still so young. Just weeks ago d became zero. As we grow further, the community is continuously working to watch and tweak the parameters so that the network stays healthy and decentralized. I trust the community. Below is a nice detailed blog explaining all the parameters and how the teams are keeping track of them.

All this said, one thing is for sure, there is no perfect set of parameters. There will always be some groups left disadvantaged. In the end we don’t want everybody to become a spo.

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27

I agree with that “don’t want everybody to become a spo.”
So almost SPO will be retired more and more monthly.
Ada’s price drive it.

Finally will be no one want to become a SPO.
Required block minted value is too high.

$ 1Million is some nation’s house price,
but some nation’s much more expensive than 10 times lifetime work.

Is this decentralized?
I don’t agree that.
Some guys and nations are will be dominate this network.

3 Likes
28

I share the same point of view!

29

Hey Razzi!
100% Agree.
This whole thread went off the rails though.
You said “Don’t you think that stake pool that cannot mint new blocks should still receive delegation rewards from the Cardano network?”
Then ADA4good started railing that you will never write a block at low stake.
Ok, that is the point.
What Razzi said, was that he can’t write a block.
What the delegation award from both Cardano foundation and IHOK does, is help you write a block when you can’t. LOL
SO, the fact that they require you to write a block, before they help you write a block, because you don’t have the stake to write a block is not very logical.
Instead, the requirement to have “minted blocks in the past” should be removed.
And replaced with, “have minted blocks, or have never minted blocks” with the stipulation that if a pool misses a block because of misconfiguration, the delegation is redelegated after 1 epoch, vs one quarter.
There are 1500 pools that have never minted a block.
If you’ve minted a block, at 100K or less, your either very lucky or very persistent. Also willing to loose your own rewards. Because again, you’re not writing blocks on the pool your delegated too. Your own.
We recently stood up a node. With 1 ADA. And after 3 epochs no blocks. We’re loosing 1K every 5 days because we’re not getting rewards.
So even at 1M, you’re not in the clear.
Only at 5M does your chance of 0 blocks go below 1%.

So, “Should small pools (under 2M) that have never written a block, be able to receive the Cardano and IHOK 15M delegation for 1 quarter?!”

YES

As long as that pools is all the other things on the list.

Having written a block to receive an award to help you write blocks, is again, illogical.

The rule is only in place so that they don’t delegate to a misconfigured pool. I assume at least. So that should be mitigated differently, while not excluding more than half the pool population.

2 Likes
30

I’m currently working on setting up a stake pool, and I gather information.
How much do you pledge so as to have 0.03 estimated blocks ?

@ADA4Good took the example of 10K ADA pledge giving a 0.01 estimated blocks.
I wonder if you @razzi have pledged something more like 20K, 30K, or 40K to achieve 0.03

I’ve not used the calculator indicated by @ADA4Good yet. There’s still some parameters that are too vague for me, I need to continue learning.

31

The odds of finding a block is only dependant on the total active stake in a pool. The active stake is the delegated amount of all delegators plus the pool owners pledge.

Here you can read a very simple way to estimate your odds:

1 Like
32

In my case, I have pledge 15k and I have another 17K delegated. In total 32K active stake.

1 Like
33

It is a great short And rich article. Block per epoch = active stakes / 1M .

The 1M number was set when Ada price were few cents, do you know What was the exact price at the time?

What do you think this number should be now?

34

Thank you @razz. I have a mission to write cardano related blogs with less than 199 words.

I remember buying ada for a few cents in 2020… We have come far since…

I am not familiar enough with the calculation method to say what needs to be changed. I trust the community does.

35

I agree. Marketing skills should not be such a heavy influence. Isn’t it about greater and greater decentralization with good pool operators? I think even just taking 10 ADA/Epoch as a reward for 99% up time would be a big help. Take it from the treasury cut.

2 Likes
36

Although, I understand your point, what would be the incentive for a small SPO to actually keep the pool running if they would still receive rewards?

37

The incentive will be to receive more than the fix X (5 for example, I think 10 is too much) ADA per epoch.
The fact that the pool is up and running 24/7 and is able to mint blocks, i think is a good reason to have this fix “small” reward per epoch.