Theoretically; how would one convert Ada to FIAT anonymously and without triggering taxes?

I don’t trust leaders, I trust those chronically unimpressed grey-haired professors with 3 PhDs in macro economics and 40 years of experience that get hired by leaders to deal with all the complex stuff, which takes years to do :slight_smile: I kinda trust my leaders to not force me to declare profits after buying a cup of coffee.

The whole point that I was making - is that:

  1. There’s no much sense in trying to imagine tomorrow’s life with today’s technology. Paying taxes for crypto today is a pain in the arse (when possible at all) just cuz the technology itself is virtually non-existent yet.

  2. The point with economists was about the fact that world-economy was hard as heck to deal with before crypto too, so crypto did not actually make it that much harder (from strictly economic perspective), just shifted the responsibilities a bit. Everyone for some reason reckon the fact that people would manage their own money as something of profound significance, like never in the history of human kind there ever was a time when banks didn’t control everyone’s money. And all economists really reacting like: “What? People want to handle their own money again? Ok, then we gonna recalculate some indexes a bit.” :slight_smile:

  3. Most of problems with taxes come from: a) deficit of comfy technology that would track and calculate all your stuff for you; and b) lack of understanding for now on how private should a private really be, and how people declare their private txs, and socio-economic stuff like this.

Technology is coming. Internet of 2000 was nothing like internet of 1990, and the same in the next 10 years. Crypto of 2028 will be nothing like crypto of 2018. Great technology is on it’s way, but it’s taking YEARS of hard labour to produce all of the stuff that we are accustomed to. And so does the socio-economic stuff, or even more so )


Taxes is general or taxes related to cripto :slight_smile:? Because I live in NYC, I think I have my fair share covered :sob:

I’m assuming Bitcoin ATMs that exist are only for purchase of Bitcoin. Because if you could sell your Bitcoin for Fiat then you sell Ada/Bitcoin, and take out Fiat at the Bitcoin ATM.

Disclaimer: I do not condone the intentional illegal avoidance of taxes. :slight_smile:

BTW, with a feed to an exchange to buy/ sell quickly and with a decent spread, this could be a good business.

I live in Italy :scream_cat: … but on the Northern border where tax laws are considered in a German way :sob:

No, I mean, if there is a mass adoption and FIAT’s income and taxation fall noticeably.

Sean you have a lot of smart questions on this forum, however when it comes to this one most countries differentiate in tax laws between purchase of goods in a foreign currency vs profit/loss on a currency speculation.

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Unfortunately, in the US if you purchase with bitcoin then you have to pay capital gains if your mark to market is positive. So there’s no differentiation between cash exchange or exchange for goods for @SeanAlimov. I’ll check the ruling but I’m 99% positive.

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Since the majority of the forum is in English I forgot to factor in that the people here are pretty much from all over the world. I guess the cripto taxes on capital gains are US specific.

It’s definitely an, intended or unintended, barrier to entry for Crypto in the US. If I buy Sterling for a trip to the UK, and it strengthens against the Dollar and I buy goods and services with Sterling I don’t have to pay capital gains. Now those swings are minuscule compared to the current Crypto market volatility. But to @Eystein_Hansen’s point - it’s kind of absurd that you have to pay capital gains when buying a cup of coffee, but technically in the US as things stand you would if your mark to market is positive. This will become as much of a pain for the IRS as the tax payer assuming the market continues to grow. Long term it is untenable.


On the positive note, :ada: hit .30! Wooohooo!

Indeed. I’m a little conflicted there, because I was hoping it would get to .10 - .08 to pick up more size. :slight_smile:

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I’m really glad that the :cardano: community is a “Discourse style” forum. I can literally feel the format forcing me to get smarter by exercising my mind in a way that it is not normally used to. The editing tools allow me to refine my points. The community is structured in a way to pull the members collective minds to come to a consensus over an an idea or a topic. It even forces me to structure my arguments in a way that account for more than one point of view. Destructuring ideas while avoiding personal attacks, in order to bring people over rather than alienate them. Having discussions with people that I feel are smarter then myself is encouraging me to step up a level and it’s an unexpected and pleasant surprise. Whoever had the genius idea to structure the :cardano: forum in such a way was spot on!


Having worked 3 decades in and around the financial services industry I can see what you mean and feel exactly what you have written; well stated!

I could not have described it better.
The thoughts on crypto topics are not only very complex in terms of research and technology, but also concern many more areas about which you sometimes have to sleep a few nights. This forum is great for getting to know new perspectives and aspects


as a word of advice, remember that if you’ve spent crypto to buy something or a service, this is already considered a taxable event in which you could report a loss or a gain.

I strongly recommend using sooner than later so you can do your taxes in the future and have a clear view of your crypto assets. very good service, couldn’t have done my taxes this year without it. Supports all coins, including ADA.

This is a matter of local income tax legislation and interpretation of this in your respective countries which may vary greatly.

Generally if you speculate and trade it is difficult to avoid taxation. If you buy one actual currency with the intent of spending it for goods and services it may not be more taxable than the foreign currency you buy for your next vacation.

Where im from i may not get taxed if i simply hold and wait for crypto payment options. If i realize gains into fiat i will get taxed. Afaik. Also a lot is happening here so things may change for the worse most likely.