Illegal price-fixing on DEXs


Imo there is not logical reason why the batcher fees still exists, besides that 2a is way to much ~1 USD, with this amount I can stay on ethereum.

Economically a dex with lower TVL should have started to reduce this fee to attract more people, so that the TVL increases, but non of them did or those, so I believe there is a price-fixing between the DEXs.

I know that this are serious accusations, but using DEXs on cardano is a joke with this fee,
Zaping +2a
Farming +2a
So 4a ~2usd for just placing something in the farm?!

Claiming +2a
(maybe swapping +2a)
Pooling +2a
Farming +2a
6a for a cycle? Why on earth should I use cardano?

To me the reason is clear the DEXs earn a lot of ada this way and the argument of that they need the money to develop is bogus, that’s what a DEX token is for.

Imo we all should reach out the IGO or Charles, because this is illegal price-fixing and non of them want to cut off one’s nose to spite off one’s face.


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I agree that these fees are too high. But, competition will eventually drive fees down.

No! Charles Hoskinson and IOG are not in control. This is a decentralised blockchain system.

If you want this to change then demand that all the smart contract code you use be open-sourced. If it is not open-sourced AND audited then how can you trust it anyway?

Open sourcing the smart contract code will bring more scrutiny and more competition. High fees are a sign that it is still early and the big players haven’t entered the arena yet.

  1. wether Charles nor IOG is able to change anything in that matter
  2. if you dont like those DEX’s dont use it
  3. if you belive that you could run and maintain a DEX with less money, go for it and build it and earn some good money

This is a decentralized network and people are free to build on top of it what ever they like and charge what ever they want. If you dont like their service, dont use it. Its simple as that.


I don’t know what this has to do with decentralization?
Nodes are decentralized, I don’t know what this has to do with a smart contract running on a blockchain. You are talking about anarchy.
The community fund is part of decentralization, because the power of the decision is decentralized.

And we as a community could choose to remove a smart contract from a blockchain, it happened before that even funds from a wallet have been remove.

And you underestimate the influence of Charles or IGO. With a vote a lot is possible and this is decentralization, as not a single person nor a DEX could stop the community if they decide that certain DEXs are being ban or so.

It might even be necessary that although permissionless, regulation will force blockchains to remove code running on a blockchain, will see how far it will go with tornado cash.

And what is that for an argument? If you don’t like the DEX don’t used?!
The problem is that the all dexes on cardano having this fee right now. What kind of choice is that?
And running a dex myself, sorry it feels more like you are trolling right now.
Why do you invest in Crypto? Don’t like fiat? Then don’t use it?! Or make a currency yourself?! Srsly?
Don’t like the government, then leave the country?! Or make a government yourself?!

And this is decentralization, reaching out to the community as we can change something. I don’t like this attitude. This is how it is, you can’t do anything about it, it’s sink or swim…
Cardano was built to make a change and not to take things as they are.

That functionality is not implemented. We do not even have community votes up to now (except for the non-auditable Catalyst votes, whose effects are still executed by hand by IOG employees).

On Cardano? When? How?

While Cardano is far from being completely decentralised with IOG still having a monopoly on development, deciding on the features, basically leaving SPOs no other option than installing whatever they throw at them, while they still have the power (with or without some say by the foundation) to single-handedly change protocol parameters, they do not have the power to remove contracts or reverse arbitrary transactions.

They could build that power into a cardano-node update. Given the average Haskell literacy of the community, such a change could even stay unnoticed, and this update installed through the ecosystem (as above: very little choice, anyway). But on the other hand, that’s a massive change that has no (publically known) planning and design, up to now. They even have a hard time getting the carefully planned hard fork out of the door, right now. I don’t see them being able to implement DEX banning or transaction reversal just like that.


None of the DEXes has any “official” backing. They just started them. And decided that they need these fees to be somehow profitable. (I doubt that they still are with the declining interest after the first hype. But they would be even less with lower fees.)

You could look for a team and try to create a DEX with cheaper fees. Everyone is free to do that and doesn’t need Charles’ or the community’s approval. … And the existing ones also don’t need that and are free to operate at their fees.

You do realise that cryptocurrencies are just that – people making a currency themselves? … still with an uncertain future and a lot of people thinking it is as ridiculous as you think it sounds.

Electing another government or starting or supporting a revolution to get one are exactly the options if you don’t like the government. If there is no choice that suits you, you really have to create one yourself (or ask yourself if it is maybe not so easy to create a viable alternative, at least not as easy as hating on the government is).

Cardano gives you the opportunity to build. Why should it give the opportunity to shut down other projects, because you think they are too expensive?


I agree fees are too high right now, but you are correct in all statements here. Lower fees will come as a result of competition, not by declaration of Charles or any other figurehead.


I think you forgot a not.
When is it competition? Aren’t 5 DEXs(according to defillama) already competition?

It’s not about Charles or IOG setting the price, in a way they actually did, by setting the tx fees, it’s about illegal price-fixing.

All 3 big DEXs, wing riders, minswap and sundaeswap have those fees. In the beginning there was this hype around sundaeswap, but it faded and now it is kind of a sideshow. Economically it would have made sense to remove those fees to attract more people, but they didn’t. Why would someone do that?

I don’t think it’s anything nefarious. They can charge it and people will pay it.

Even if a cheaper option comes around, it’s not guaranteed people will even choose to use it. Look at’s 2% fees, only has a 1% fee, but majority of people continue to use jpg.

People vote with their ADA and voices. Wouldn’t be such a stretch to say the fees contribute to the TVL of these DeFi projects remaining so low.


You neither give conclusive evidence that there even was a price-fixing, a secret agreement between the DEXes, nor that that would have been illegal (in what jurisdiction, anyway? not everybody is in the US, most people aren’t).

If the fees are baked into the contracts, they can’t easily change them, but would have to roll out whole new contracts. If they change the scooper fees, they first would have to consult all their scoopers if they are fine with that.

They may have decided that it makes more sense to wait for the trades that have a volume, where their fees are insignificant, than to lower the fees, so that people can profitably trade basically worthless shit tokens.

That they don’t follow your personal definition of economic sense doesn’t mean that they are doing something illegitimate or even illegal and the community, King Charles, or even the authorities should jump on them.

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I think the fees are high currently and I don’t use the DEXs. But I also agree that they are probably not profitable currently even with these “high” fees.

The reason I say this is because it is still very very early. We don’t even have a proper stable coin on Cardano yet. A wrapped version of USDC is not what I call a proper stable coin. I want a proper decentralised stable coin like Djed.

I won’t be doing any of this crazy token swapping through a DEX and I won’t look to borrow or lend against my Ada until there is something like Djed for the other side of the trade. I think you will find that there are many people like me that won’t use these DEXs until things get sorted out more and there is a proper stable coin. Once that happens, you will see the market mature, DEXs and lending platforms will get used more, competition will increase, and fees will come down. It might take a little while.