Would Ethereum reaching PoS mean the dead end for Cardano?

What are the consequences that Cardano need to bear if Ethereum reach PoS much earlier than Cardano as a final product. ETH has a very big network effects and big community. The Devs and everything favours them as from the point is see.

On the other hand, what makes Cardano better than Eth to survive? I know lot of you will reply : Peer review, Layered protocoll and so on…
But these still doesnt sound gud enough to replace ETH

How do you make that judgement?


Network effects. U must be lot better to replace something that already exist and has the 2nd biggest network effects

What I’m wondering is how you value Cardano’s particular features, so you can judge them either good enough to topple ETH or not. As far as I can see this is a unique situation, so how do you do that?


No. Cardano does at the outset (in Shelley or Goguen, not exactly sure), what ETH does with CASPER, except it does it right, rather than based on good engineering intuition only - by employing discrete proofs of correctness of the claims being made. Ethereum is bolting on PoS as an afterthought. Vitalik may be super smart, but it’s obvious to me, at least based on what I’ve seen, that he has not provided similar elaboration and proof of correctness of CASPER the same way IOHK’s team did. Cardano’s PoS concept, Ouroboros, is the crown jewel, the center piece if you will, of their protocol upon which the entire foundation rests. Not saying Ethereum may not get lucky and succeed with CASPER, but the difference in their approach to this problem is almost like night and day when compared to IOHK’s.


And mainly, what makes Ouroboros better than Casper???

XRP seem to have done just that on coinmarketcap, without “network effects”, developer support or decent exchange listings for that matter.

Bottom line: if you product is of institutional grade in security, interoperability and simple continuity, it doesn’t matter what kind of network of devs you have. ETH will never be a standard for mass adoption as it lacks maturity for that.

Vitalik can’t even say he has confidence in his own network. He can’t assure investors that the info you put on his chain will exist 15-20 years from now.

That’s a huge turnoff for pretty much any serious early adopter. They missed their boat with DAO hack. Imagine if you are the World Bank. You issued a huge loan to Zimbabwe recorded it on ethereum right after the hack. Your loan would have been made invalid in current eth ecosystem.

This just can’t happen in a serious blockchain.

Many people underestimate the genius of Cardano’s design, in how it addresses these hairy issues in its architecture.


Let’s try some simplification. Assuming both are competing for the same market and both have tech plans equally good. Then the team, which has quicker R&D will create technically superior solution sooner. Does anybody know how many people Cardano VS ETH have?
Technical superiority is however not enough. Adoption is the next step after the tech enables the use cases and marketing in many forms comes next. What is the key here? Marketing man power? Luck? The tx/sec can be a however a good measure of adoption. ETH has https://etherscan.io/chart/tx do you know of similar chart for ADA?

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  1. Comparing to XRP makes no sense, comparing to ETH does coz they are comparing for the same markets.
  2. Why do you think, ETH lacks maturity? I would really like to know.
  3. Cardano doesnt have any incentives to punish dishonest validatiors. ETH on the other had does. The validator will loose his stake and thus preventing possible attacks to the network. I dunno what incentives cardano has to secure the network from attacks?
  4. That just means Vitalik is just bein honest there and not giving any kind of false promises. Lambo and Moon!!!
  5. No i dont have these charts. will be very nice if you can share if it exists.

Who can implement sharding first will be as important if not more than if Eth beats Cardano to POS. Based on my research and intuition I believe Cardano is in a better place to achieve its goals in a faster and cleaner way. It does not have a lot of legacy issues to deal with. It has a unified dev team that is getting stronger and putting systems in place to implement work faster. It has proper scientists directing the dev team so there will be less false starts. It is designed to be continually upgradeable. But let’s say that Eth does beat Cardano to market with working product. Cardano has at it’s core been about doing what Eth can do but doing it better and making it easy to migrate from Eth to Ada. Next 8 months will be interesting. As to what is better Oroborus or Casper. Depends on who you talk to. I say Oroborus. The Oroborus papers are easy to find. Casper papers not as easy. You should Google booth and tell us what conclusions you find.

At the end of the day both will be around in my opinion.


Having said all that, Shelly release still got delayed.

There are reasons for it. Growing pains if you will. The question is are they learning from their mistakes. I see evidence that says they are.


And mainly, what makes Ouroboros better than Casper???

I can’t answer that in a single post or even multiple posts - it would take a lot more space and this forum is inappropriate for it. But you’re welcome to read the original Ouroboros paper as well as the additional 2 that have been written on it and peer reviewed, as well as CASPER’s design paper and draw your own judgments.


well i would. But lot of stuffs are technical and way too complicated. If you would like, we can have a chat privately on Telegram or Whatsappp or whatever

Yes, the approaches are different.

Ethereum is treating it as a software project, they are using a prototyping approach. If you are unfamiliar it may look like they are making a bunch of mistakes and it’s very haphazard, but that is how this approach works. You first create a prototype that is a loose approximation to what you think you want, then iterate through a succession of prototypes, each one closer to the final solution. Notice the requirement itself is elicited through the process, it is not known or decided from the outset.

Cardano are doing it more like an engineering project, as you would design a large bridge or skyscraper, the entire thing is designed and proved upfront. People did used to write software like this quite a while ago, but it tends to be mostly prototyped these days.

It awaits to be seen which process is better suited for this domain.


LOL, sure, sling it out there and encourage people to use & invest in a haphazard protocol 'cause - “that is how this approach works.” ???

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Casper is down for 2020, so Ethereum won’t reach PoS earlier than Cardano. Also Casper is not Pos, it’s partial PoS (at least right now, Ethereum change their requirement as they go, this is intentional, see my other reply), so even when they have Casper, they will still be using PoW.

Yes they do.

Well, the Devs havn’t really had a choice, right now it’s the only Smart Contract platform in town. Ok, Tezos is too, but it’s only been live 3? months. EOS has been live a touch longer but has real issues… Anyway, until quite recently Ethereum has been the only choice, so we don’t really know if it is “favoured” or “default”.

Bitcoin doesn’t burn anyone’s coins either. Burning coins is just lazy incentive design. Last week some guy lost 30K USD on Tezos by accidentally running a process twice. Would you operate a full node for Tezos - I wouldn’t. The reward for making the block should be the incentive. This is actually a plus for Cardano IMHO.

I’d compare them like this:

Ethereum has been live for a while, has a bunch of SC code written for it, is familiar to devs and some brand recognition with the public. On the downside, it’s very difficult (slow) to make fundamental changes to a live system. It’s a money system, you have to be real careful, partial PoS in 2020, or maybe even 2021.

Cardano has been designed from day one to be fully PoS, once it decentralises, end of Q1 2019 and it’s EVM goes live Q2-Q3(?) it will be functionally equivalent to Ethereum. It will be able to run any Ethereum SC, so any projects can port; true that’s not quite the same as having running code, but it’s next best thing. They are also half way through developing other SC languages, it won’t just be Solidity.

I like both projects. I guess you have to weigh up Ethereum’s lead in terms of brand recognition, developer community and live code. How “sticky” will developers be? I really don’t know. Maybe they will switch en mass, maybe they won’t, maybe they will run their dApps on both - who can predict such things?! How much brand recognition does Ethereum have with the public? Bitcoin’s brand penetration is very good, but Ethereum? Not so much, but that could change in the next 6 months. It’s hard to predict the future. And we are just comparing two cryptos, things may happen in the wider market to upset the applecart in unpredictable ways.


Just saw this which might have relevance:

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You are comparing BTC to ETH. That makes no sense. These are two different cryptos by design. The network effect? Where are your charts to quantify that? For all I care, network effects is just a buzzword people like to throw around without understanding what it is and how it works. The fact that ETH has a bunch of developers now, doesn’t mean a thing. Things are super fluid in this space now and I wouldn’t hold my breath for ETH to stay in the top 5 for too long.

If you go by market cap, which by extension, reflects wider crypto community’s confidence in tech, then you can totally compare any coin. In that realm XRP (again) has trumped ETH. This may have to do with the bleak prospects of ETH to actually reach any meaningful adoption before a number of competing platforms will.

Oh, I don’t know… Their handling of DAO hack? And this:

It speaks volumes about their thought process. Sounds like a crapshoot to me as in " let’s spitball this and see what happens… And if you lose your money, well maybe you are SOL!"

That’s the beauty of it. You don’t need an extra “moving part” to take care of dishonest players. Ouroboros is likely to just ignore bad messages, which is nothing short of brilliant! The end result is the same but Cardano’s solution is more elegant. Why? Well, maybe because some brilliant scientists (as opposed to smart college dropouts) are working on it?

LOL. That is hilarious, especially if you take into consideration the audience where this question was asked. Vitalik couldn’t vouch for his chain to a group of top World Bank officials in Washington DC. This is by far not your average lambo + moon joes.

For the technology that claims immutability as one of its main selling points, not being confident about your chain is nothing short of shameful. Translation: I don’t see how any serious player would consider them for their needs. Again, my example above showcases this pretty clearly.

I suggest you start here and educate yourself about Cardano tech stack… if you are serious of course.

Good luck!