Big Phil, come on man,don’t be an old stick in the mud bro.Who cares man, SHOW ME THE MONEY!!! Then most of us gonna party.You wanna get down, or be talking scientific principles with those duds Geeza,Quasimoto Dullek etc.
That’s all good. Don’t mind if you wanna have a chat with others on the forum in a non-serious joking manner. I just got the impression that your original post was serious and you were looking for an academic debate about it.
Now that I and others understand the context of your post, we can choose whether we want to be part of that type of conversation.
For me, I’m not interested. But have fun.
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I really like this question. It’s wise for any investor to ask such. Lets be honest, how many of us invested hard earned money in a token to help poor unbanked persons. Lets me add to that question this fact >>> after the initial sale of ADA to investors how many of us understand every token we by or sell has nothing to do with Cardano s progress. It doesn’t fund them one penny. So unless you were in the initial group of investors launching the development you are not supporting (for example) un banked Ethiopian coffee farmers. Your supporting some other guys profit opportunity as you both trade.
Is Cardano a good investment. I believed XLM and XRP were good investment that would experience market pressure from use. The reality set in. Yes their token would be used as “FEE’S” to access their systems but their tokens would not be used to represent the value of the currency they were transporting between nations or between parties using Money exchanges like Western Union. Instead a simple fee of .000001 was charged fro every transaction. XRP had to change the fee structure to compete with XLM.
XLM and XRP are both proof of work tokens. We are not and can share in earned fee’s paid to the system. At least that’s what I believe we are being told. We will NOT be earning interest. ADA is not a security.
The other issue and it is an issue, will be that any other token will be able to transact on Cardano. ADA will have a token fee much like XLM and XRP. This is just a fact of the world in which crypto lives. The key to our growth and success as profiteers will be the commercial projects built on top of Cardano that use ADA much as ETH has done. It’s the same principal. If it’s built on Cardano s blockchain it brings value through use and fee’s. (0% of the projects on ETH are useless and poverty stricken. Charles however has expressed we should consider having just 100 very good projects built on Cardano rather than 1,000 with 90% being useless. It seems reasonable to believe the value of Cardano will be very significant as companies will want a much safer and much more stable platform. Cardano will be all of that and much more.
A very important factor none of us have explored, at least no one I’ve read so far, is the FACT being more and more frequently spoken of in the usual old financial market media. AmeriTrade, Fidelity and E-Trade are all in the early stages of launching trading for BTC and ETH. Two of those entities have also stated they will be additional ETH based tokens “FIRST” and then others. When the news is reported about the design and development of Cardano is published by Licensed brokers with fiduciary responsibility ADA will be a market darling. I’ve invested for 45 years and they wont be able to help themselves. The more secure, stable highly proven, tested formal papers etc and it’s off to the races. They will give a great deal of support to the cardano system. That being said >>> our beloved Founder is a dreamer. Profit is a third or fourth thought for him at this time. Until his dream is realized in some meaningful manner he will only be frustrated by calls for attention to making you wealthy. That is how he see’s it. I would happily stand nose to nose with him and explain he is correct it’s not his job to make people wealthy and that isn’t the point. It wan’t our responsibility to fund his dream. There is or should be a mutual respect for the work, dream and those who invested expecting a return. No public company would be able to just tell their share holder go pound sand as Charles does to us. Right, it’s not a public company. The ethics and moral obligation still exists. But here is the good news. Charles has expressed he’d like to make some profit too. In fact he has stated IOHK would be a better company if Shelly were operating fully now. Bt implication he really is in our camp. He has to focus on the development and business and THAT IS appropriate.
So, bla bla bla bla, I’ve shared my thinking and some hard facts that it’s my hope will give us all more than hope. Patience to let Charles build his dream as correctly as he envisions. I believe and have confidence Charles knows what he’s doing. One thing I would encourage all of us to do is to politely impress upon Charles our desire to see ADA on AmeriTrade, Fidelity and E-Trade as soon as they can make it happen. Be polite but be insistent. Be well everyone.
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If you held shares in a corporation, you would be able to demand attention to “shareholder value”, but I don’t think that is the deal the initial investors signed up for. The folks coming in and supplying liquidity to the initial coin buyers have no relationship to the foundation. Does holding USD give you a claim on the US government?
I would say that maybe they have a responsibility to stabilize the value of the coin for the long term, but if you bought in for over the initial capitalization rate, that is on you.
Invest in systems that use the coin and the value is likely to stabilize and maybe grow. Investors in the first coins had to buy into the vision and will make their biggest returns using ADA vs. investing in ADA. Why aren’t you thinking of your ADA holdings as capital to be invested in something else? Isn’t that would you would do with Euros or dollars?
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Today, my concerns are too high in number and too broad in scope. It’s illogical to hold one accountable for what one doesn’t know; sometimes a hard thing to watch.
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Good analogy. US currency is legal tender, with relative value predicated on our perception of its strength.
What I sense from Yeshuaschildren is an open expression of real concerns. I think Charles is a capable man, with the will to do good on a big scale. I also see distinct manifestations of stress, one being his occasional abrasive talk; it’s for you to decide if anything substantive can be deduced. I am certain of one thing though, the ‘mark’ in the world he wants to leave depends, in more ways than one, on this community, today.
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Scientific or not. Years ago an old person told me that the best investment was wine. He immediately added: “you have to find a madman who wants to cough up the money” In short, a well-known recognized superior wine, something that has been made for whatever reason will more easily find a “madman” who wants to buy it than something which is perhaps very good but unknown or unloved.
For me it is certainly important that Cardano pursues scientific conditions for safety and use or speed. Because it can distinguish itself from the rest. And once this is generally known, an audience will certainly be found who wants and buys ADA. Because how you turn it around, everything revolves around money, profit and added value!
Cardano and ADA one cannot do without the other, if Cardano gets more appreciation ADA will just follow.
Previously it was also with Ripple and XRP, but since XRP was separated from Ripple, XRP remains powerless with a minimum value. Because Ripple may become stronger in the bank, but the general public does not like XRP anymore.
Translates with Google Translate, from Dutch to English.
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Your premise is incorrect on several points. Shares in a corporation are a security. very important not to make the mistake of think or ADA as a security. You are not earning interest. With ADA one participates in profit making by participating in a staking pool. I seriously doubt people really out hundreds of thousands of dollars in the Cardano project to fund the dream. At least not sophisticated investors. They would invest in the projects profit opportunity. They would evaluate the team and the goals. Are they realistic? Is the need for the solution offered? Can it be achieved in a reasonable time frame?
There was no supplying of liquidity. That’s a trading term. People supplied cold hard cash for ADA two rise from pennies to dollars and it did. People who followed are strictly speaking profiteers. They were trading for profit. AND it’s my contention that Charles is really speaking to this group. He’s right. It’s not his job to make them wealthy. If we are in that group we are included. And actually when I hold a dollar, yes it does give me a claim on the US Government. It is their responsibility to back the dollar so that it’s face value is honored when something the sold, bought, traded, held ETC. A dollar is a security. It’s a Promissory note in effect guaranteeing the Government will stand behind it’s face value.
They have no responsibility to do anything regarding the value of the Token. Nothing at all. They don’t even see it as anything more than a utility token. Chances are you will never use ADA as a currency. It can be but never will be unless something changes dramatically. Charles is talking about building a stable coin for the system. Will it be backed by Gold, Oil, fiat dollars ADA or perhaps staking pool earnings?? I have no idea. Why is it any different from our usual fiat currency if it’s backed by fiat currency or gold? Kind of make the whole idea of crypto a joke if it’s backed by the unstable, untrustworthy things it was intended to replace.
since the first day of trading everybody has purchased ADA at prices ove the initial price ADA was sold at. Everybody. If you think that was to point of my comments then I failed to write clearly.
Your last paragraph doesn’t make sense. The ADA token will be used in staking and as the operating token. Other tokens will be used on the system as well. This potentially could rob stakeholders of earnings if there isn’t some conversion where staking benefits. The first investors probably liked the vision of creating blockchain economies in nations with a majority of unbanked people. BUT today that vision is “I want to change to world” “I want to change the world of banking and we will have to do it by forcing our way in, we can’t compete with those who control the markets now”. These are comments stated in similar words by Charles. Not exact quotes word for word. It’s what he said.
Look at XLM and XRP. Neither has staking pools. Both shared a common founder. At XRP he was one of the founders. He disagreed with them and left. XLM he linked up with a gal, and now he says XLM is not an investment, yet no one seems to ever reference the two places in which he says it. He’s honest about his token. He said the only place to make money with it is in trading.
It’s very important to understand ADA. Via staking pools ADA will reflect some value. From use of the blockchain by various projects the blockchain will gain in value as a perception. More use makes it more valuable. Look at ETH. What made it valuable was all the ERC20 tokens operating ON the blockchain, 90% of which are trash. Charles made this point when talking in an AMA as he reasoned with people worrying about the value of ADA. Even team members have been very disappointed by it’s lack of performance. He’s getting pressure from more than just us. His point was that he was planning on building high quality projects (he used the number 100 as an example). Charles is focused on building value into the blockchain? How valuable will markets see ADA. Add the actual sophistication of Cardano to the equation and comparatively speaking there is no true competitor. Will markets value this or will they see it as over engineered because others do the same work with a lot less engineering. We do not know. I believe commercial companies will Value it highly.
One last point; Ameritrade, ETrade and Fidelity are definitely moving towards trading crypto. ETrade apprease to be a bit more aggressive with the idea stating recenty they plan to add to BTC and ETH a number of ERC 20 tokens as well and then others. This will launch hundreds of billions of dollars into the crypto space. We will see ADA benefit from this transition but only if Charles allows it to be on the exchanges. The Company has to agree at this point. Later it will be the Pool’s who will vote. I believe due to the sophistication of these processes it’s necessary to have a Charles initiate the necessary documentation, and contacts in preparation to create a glide path to trading on these platforms. We should all request this of IOHK, The Cardano Foundation and EMURGO. Lets see what they say.
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For the benefit of all, it would be great if you used dialogue continuity tools eg.
quotes
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I think you are the one who is confused about the logic and cryptoeconomics of the system. I don’t have the time or energy to argue with you.
Staking and fees only relate to sustainability to the extent they fund staking pool operators. The rest of that process is crypto-economic speculation. Not necessarily a bad thing, but you have to realize that it is not well connected (in system dynamics) to the exchange value of the currency. That will be determined by the use value of the currency, not the exchange value. If the exchange value is very volatile, it will very negatively effect the use value (can’t rely on price because exchange value uncertainty).
Now, the Cardano treasury could implement policy to stabilize the currency value, but that is not practical until there is sufficient use value and transaction traffic.
As clueless observer, I think @Yeshuaschildren was very clear in his last post, unfortunately @Gerry you are trying hard to sound sophisticated on very simple issues. Abstract generalization
is not very practical.
Brad Z likes baconhead coin
What is
Do you have a URL to information about this as I have never heard of it?
Thanks
Sorry, I don’t understand what you are talking about, or why you have posted something very random to this thread a month after it went quiet.
Do you have anything of interest to say on this topic?
Hi Noddyholmes.
What nice of you to get back with an other account after your other account was suspended for a month. Regarding the fact that you didn’t learn after the second time I am sorry to notify you about your third warn - which is permanent.
I hope you can better your life outside our forum.
With kind regards,
Andy.
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I am glad you won’t argue. It’s a waste of time. The arcane differences in the two forms of currency is rather simple while the mechanisms are not.
But be that as it may I will stick with my comments until I see the ADA system functioning. Theory is subject to transient issues that rise in practical use.
I am not confused regarding the differences or the economics. I speak to the differences. AND there are differences.
It’s not important. No chest beating here, Just offering comments.