What do you think the 2018 USD low will be for ADA?


ok, so there is no evidence at all, apart from the secret evidence that you can’t show me.

are you even for real, or just trolling?


Sounds like you are only searching for the answer your want to hear in my opinion.

  1. Your wallet is so secure, more than any bank account or credit card. Yes, it is so secure that if you forget your “seed” / account, not even you can get you money back no matter how much proof that you can provide that it is yours including spending history, DNA, going in person, etc.

  2. Your name, DOB, SSN is all you need to open a bank account. OK so you have someone’s info, go open an account in their name. It’s not that easy as you will find out. You may be able to open it but now you’ve just put yourself on the grid and you’be violated a number of laws. Not to mention, there are several safeguards at many junctures that will result in flags being triggered. It’s just not that easy.

  3. Credit card fraud is so easy it’s laughable. Another misconception yet again. If its so easy, everyone would be doing it yet the FBI statistics show that more robberies and burglaries are causes of theft than credit card fraud. It may be easy to dupe someone to accept it, but in many places, there is a standard practice of 2 forms of ID, signature verification and again, you have to be in possession of the card and at the business location to commit the crime. Hacking a crypto wallet/or user exposing themselves can be done from the other side of the planet, literally.

  4. Exposing you cc #. The trend has moved away from this. Most cards now are chip. Apple Pay uses differential privacy and card number is never exposed. Next.

  5. Who is going to insure an asset that can be comprised through a guess of the account attributes or one that if the user forgets the holding account is lost forever? Let’s see…I open an account get my seed, deposit my funds, meet someone over coffee, given them my seed, tell them to fly to another country, go to an Internet cafe, use the seed, extract the funds, when done let me know, i claim it on insurance. No Thank you…I dont think that will work. What company will insure an asset class that has to be replaced if the holder even in multi sig circumstances dies and dies without telling the other half the seed or their pass?

  6. Interest and fees are incentives and disincentives. This is part of the game theory behind banking. Pay your bills on time and you get a lower rate, dont pay on time and you get a penalty. As a service, we provide a place to store your money, if someone steals it, dont worry, we have you covered.

With crypto, you have penalties and incentives for staking. Stake and you get some crypto. Work and you get some coins (POW). Store your money on this super secure wallet. If someone steals it, its on you. If you forget your credentials, its on you. If you wrote it down and your house burned down, youre fucked.

  1. Banking separates you from your assets. You can assume this is bad if you’re a bad actor. For most, the money, my money is available. I’ve never had an issue getting money that was legitimately mine. Have you? In instances where the bank has a right to protect itself and let transactions clear before providing a credit, this is understood to be part of the process and game theory. This in principle will be the same with smart contracts. Let me guess someone is going to script a contract that allows transfer of funds without the contract being fulfilled. I dont think so.

  2. ACH takes days and SWIFT takes weeks. Uh, nope. ACH takes days and SWIFT takes days. Part of this is due to the Patriot act as well as other banking regulations. This however is a legitimate point. XRP/Ripple is poised to disrupt this however, this being the case, you’d have to deal with the argument that Ripple is centralized. Instantaneous transfers can be done now in several ways such as PayPal, Apple Pay, Venmo, banking apps, etc. With Apple Pay, the funds are on your device, not in a bank. The same cane be said with other forms f payment like paypal, etc. Seems like the argument now boils down to sending large sums of money which would either fall under control of the patriot act, require insurance, or fall under some other regulation or law t ensure compliance with subverting funds, evasion,etc., or making sure funds are not being sent to a rogue nation/bad actor. So what is the main use case then if small amounts (under 9999.99) be done through electronic means already? Looks like smart contracts seems to be the only thing left, right?

Transactions fees are low? Transact by BTC lately?

You own your funds and no one can force you to surrender those funds. Please. If a guy was going to chop off your arm, kill your family, kill your dog, lock you away forever, torture your loved ones, I’m sure they could force you to turn over your funds. Let’s not go there. Maybe someone doesnt have any of these and they are the exception but I’m sure they definitely aren’t the rule no matter how much you hate your sister, mom, dad, dog, neighbor, self, etc.

having your funds seized if you’re in Russia or the US or wherever…OK so ask yourself this. When is the last time you’ve had to worry about having your funds seized? If its frequent, I suggest an occupational career move. You’re pointing at executions rather than the rule and that is cherry picking facts to support an argument. Let me guess, our (the US) economy is thriving because everyone is having their funds seized by the government. I think not.

Lastly, even if you go through history and look back at the days of bank robbers, many of those guys were caught and hanged. They got away with some money and even on the big notable heists, it wasn’t a notable amount because they had to carry it away on horses. Crypto has been out in the mainstream now for a few years and had some of the largest if not largest heists in all time. Safe huh? Some of those people got replacement coins back and only after the coin was valued less because of the very hack where they lost their money. Sounds like a sound investment to me.

Invest in crypto as you would a craps table or roulette wheel. It’s gamble and thats all. Most here are speculating for greed and nothing more nothing less. There are some with a greater vision, I’m not one of them. I’m a speculator and here for the money if my analysis proves correct. That’s the long and short of it, nothing else.


You confirm how secure the wallet is with this statement. Think about it… Security has nothing to do with your poor memory. Think of your seed as cash. If you don’t want to handle it, don’t hold it. Some people store them in Swiss bank vaults.

I guarantee you can open bank accounts online with all that info. The question is about safety/security not about breaking the law. It is the fact you can open an account with that info online.

You are comparing one crime with another crime (unrelated to crypto), which in and of itself doesn’t negate the fact that credit card fraud is easy. I have been subject to one… unapproved charges in the thousands of dollars. The fact that their frequency is less than that of another crime type is irrelevant. What’s relevant is the probability of someone hacking your wallet against the probability of debit/credit card fraud.

Well, find even one person who has done that. In that realm crypto is infinitely more secure than your credit/debit card.

That’s only true if you are making the purchase in person. But how many times have you been asked to present a credit card with an ID (unless you were buying liquor)?

Online purchases do not require any form of presence and if you have the info you hit the jackpot.

It doesn’t apply to online purchases. How many people do you think use apple pay compared to visa/mastercard? not a whole lot.

You don’t need insurance for your account money as no one can spend it but the holder of the private key. In fact, cryptography and math are your insurance. If you doubt this, just think about why BTC survived for 10 years. It can’t be killed/hacked/compromised. We all have to deal with it. It’s as ubiquitous as internet itself at this point.

If you want a second layer of protection, that would be your agreement with the Swiss vault. This has been working for years for many. I am sure it will work 10 years from now.

That’s a nice system in the US, but you forget about the rest of the world. Let’s say the banks aren’t that friendly/accommodating. In the US you have a cap of $250K per account so if you want protection for more than that, you have to pay up or create a myriad of accounts.

That’s right. Like I said, its like cash. If you forget or your house burns down, I hope you have a backup somewhere in the bank vault.

That’s a very convenient/lazy thing to say. What do you think makes crypto so criminal that you can’t use your credit card to buy it? I mean for fuck’s sake you can buy casino chips which are KNOWN to be a rigged game with odds against you. You can buy lottery tickets.

You can gamble the whole credit line if you will, but you can’t buy crypto. Have you thought about why? And don’t tell me it’s because of compliance/KYC BS. Every entry point to this ecosystem identifies you and once that’s done, tracing your transactions becomes easy.

You are right. transfers can be done in minutes with the current technology, BUT the whole transit route of your money is subject to myriad of inter-banking, government regulation. I don’t even want to go into how much money is tied up in NOSTRO accounts to actually make this happen. It is inefficient, costly and quite frankly an overkill. Plus your access point is still controlled by one entity, which can decide to deny you their services. It doesn’t happen in the US, but wouldn’t you want to not have that risk to begin with? Why should one single company control my access to my funds?

With crypto, as long as you control on-ramps and off-ramps you can enable your laws and regulations in your country. What happens between the countries is not under the jurisdiction of any country. Think about it like open-water jurisdiction.

No sane person uses BTC to transfer money. Come on! lol have you tried ADA/XLM/ETH?

Lol you should counter my arguments with something that doesn’t apply to your bank account. You can do that with a bank account. If there is a threat of physical violence, you will log onto your bank account and wire the funds to anyone in the world. Guess what? you can’t reverse that transaction once it clears.

I thought i made it abundantly clear that situations where you are denied access to your funds are more prevalent in developing countries. In the US that’s not an issue obviously and no I have not been subject to any of this at home.

That’s true. We have seen some really ugly heists in this space, but if you have done any homework to really understand this space you will know that heists happened in exchanges and on Ethereum network that allowed for poorly coded smart contracts.

On a brighter note, we haven’t seen a single security breach on a US based exchange. Many exchanges have insurances in place for hacks so if you trade on American soil, your funds are safu.

I am sure you have your reasons to think this way. I have done my research and I can see the long-term potential of this technology.

Risk is when you have no idea what you are doing.


Sure. Go invest in that coin. Put all your money in it while you’re at it. I’m not drinking that kool aid. That coin doesn’t even make my list of top 50. Seriously?


You’re account number can be guessed as well. Guess what, doesn’t mean they can have what’s in the account does it?


I assume you are talking about XRP? No I don’t invest in it. My somewhat sarcastic point was that they are focused solely on first world use cases and people are eating it up. I still maintain that the true need for crypto and blockchain tech is in the third world. It will take a while for that to develop. The products that get created will surpass what we have in the first world. In the meantime the prices will do whatever they do. This is the .com crash all over again probably worse. Bad stuff needs to get flushed and good stuff will survive.


You’re missing the point. The attack vector is not trying to hack an individual wallet. If one billion people have wallets, that’s one billion lotteries waiting to be won. SHA is not random, right? It currently is not reversible but if the same values are entered the same hashes produce.

See: https://lbc.cryptoguru.org/man/theory

Then ask yourself if BTC is based off of double SHA256 how these keys were found. Not so secure now is it.


Going to a location in person cannot be brute forced. You cannot brute force my front door lock.

A lock would be way, way easier to brute force than a 256 bit key. Lock picks are a thing.

a hardware wallet that requires some form of physical connection and action to be used.

You know a hardware wallet just uses a private key the same as any other bitcoin wallet, right? The point of a hardware wallet is to keep the key offline, to protect your key from being known in case someone has access to your computer. It still uses the same 256 bit key as anything else and could still be guessed, but that would never happen.

If one billion people have wallets, that’s one billion lotteries waiting to be won.

Okay, so they only need to search a 160 bit keyspace, 2^160 is still an insanely huge number. Even if you had 4 billion computers, doing 4 billion hashes per second, with 4 billion existing keys, it would still take 584,942,417,355 years to find one.


You’re argument is dumber than shite to be honest. Some people can’t even remember their PIN numbers do you think this is going to gain wide adoption. You gave no idea obviously on marketing or uptake. Keep talking out the dude of your neck.


And so we come to the adoption point again. Where is the convenience when I can carry an atm card and transfer balances between checking and saving without having to log on, use ledger live, transfer funds, wait for the funds to post to my other wallet, then find a place that accepts it or withdraw once cards are created. Nice use case. Not. That won’t create adoption.


Sorry Steve your math is incorrect. You’re assuming that is to find one relative to any specific wallet. If can occur on the first guess if you’re lucky. Do you get it now?


Here’s an article I found on it.

On a side note my brother generates his private keys by flipping a coin to generate the required hexadecimal characters. He is always fearful the software used to generate private keys may be compromised or exploited.


Opening a bank account. So let me guess, your going to use my info to open a bank in my name. Obviously then. I gave access to the funds you used to open the account with? You’re giving me, your money??? How dumb is that? And if it is so easy to open an account, so much for the argument. Bout providing an easy way for the unbanked to get access to a bank. Seems like there is no need for crypto if I can open an account so easily, right? What’s the use case now?


It poses no threat yet several wallets have been compromised. And Daedalus does not allow you to select your own words.


Trolling. I doubt it. I buy Ada on the regular. I just like to make sure fanboys don’t ride the cc without justifying what they’re talking about.


Well that comment just killed any credibility you may have had here. That and your tinfoil hat an idea that you can crack 2^160 pks.

It’s just ridiculous at this point to continue this. You just have no capacity to follow simple logical arguments, let alone comprehend how probabilities work.


PS: If you have a rotten memory, maybe you shouldn’t play with serious tech you can’t understand.


Great an article to dispute LBC sfitten by s wallet provider. Forgive me for saying that they are biased. And what for all the users that commit the same mistake? They lose their funds forever? That should inspire confidence.


Here is the relevant part of the article:

"Didn’t the LBC already find some bitcoin addresses with funds? Yes, but there is a catch. A tiny number of funded bitcoin addresses have been purposely made with what’s called “poor entropy,” which means the numbers used as private keys were not very random. This is the same as trying to brute force someone’s ATM PIN, when they were lazy and chose to use the sequence 0000 instead of using something more unique.

With all serious addresses using truly random numbers, the LBC’s threat to bitcoin holders of the world is essentially nonexistent."

I also agree that getting a private key through seed words only is something I’d like to see changed. Working on that now along with offline transactions to have a wallet on an airgapped computer. Cardano does have more hexadecimal numbers in its keys though.


The simple fact is you do not understand the tech yourself. You’re regurgitating things you find on the web when you haven’t even completed calculus yourself. You don’t understand the math that your referencing and still cannot acknowledge the fact that it only takes a mere guess for someone to have full ownership and control of your funds through dumb luck. Add in some effort and a couple of smart people, done good hardware and you can make even better progress. Imagine that at a government or nation state level and you gave some serious issues, I bet you’re not even aware that SHA came out of the NSA. You need to go read son. While you’re at it might want to read up on some mathematical theory.


And do we have s situation where people by nature are likely hk select easy to remember things. Now easy seeds and funds stolen. So much for adoption and uptake. One of the good things of Daedalus is hex but the wallets are immediately identifiable as Ada tho.